The Power of Customer Experience in Business
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In this conversation, Ash Gomez, founder of Digital Twinners and co-founder of Orion Sky Studios, shares his journey from a sales career to running successful media companies. He emphasizes the importance of customer experience, building a strong team, and leveraging technology to enhance business operations. Ash discusses the impact of AI on the creative industry, lead generation strategies, and the significance of networking and partnerships. He also reflects on handling customer feedback and the diverse projects undertaken by Orion Sky Studios, concluding with insights on business philosophy and mindset.
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Takeaways
- Ash Gomez transitioned from a sales career to entrepreneurship.
- Digital Twinners focuses on real estate media, while Orion Sky Studios handles broader video production.
- Customer experience is crucial for business success.
- Building a strong team is essential for operational efficiency.
- AI can enhance creative processes but cannot replace human connection.
- Feedback from clients is vital for continuous improvement.
- Networking and partnerships are key to business growth.
- Authenticity and care differentiate small businesses from larger competitors.
- Choosing the right tools and processes can streamline operations.
- A positive mindset and following a plan are essential for overcoming challenges.
Chapters
00:00 Introduction to Ash Gomez and His Journey
00:03:04 The Evolution of Digital Twinners and Orion Sky Studios
00:06:03 The Importance of Customer Experience in Business
00:09:01 Building a Strong Team and Effective Processes
00:12:01 Navigating Challenges in the Photography Industry
00:15:03 Leveraging Technology and Tools for Efficiency
00:17:53 The Role of AI in Creative Industries
00:20:55 Lead Generation Strategies for Business Growth
00:23:54 Handling Customer Feedback and Reviews
00:26:53 Exploring Orion Sky Studios' Diverse Projects
00:30:12 The Power of Networking and Partnerships
00:32:53 Final Thoughts on Business Philosophy and Mindset
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Ash Gomez – Website | Website 2 | Instagram 1 | Instagram 2 | Instagram 3 | YouTube
Jonathan Mahrt – LinkedIn | Instagram | Website -
Jonathan Mahrt (A):
This is on the Flywheel, a podcast where each week we talk to entrepreneurs and professionals about the practical things they do to build and keep momentum in their personal and professional lives. Hello and welcome to on the Flywheel. I'm your host, Jonathan Mart with Flywheel Consulting. And today I'm excited to have on the podcast Ash Gomez, founder of Digital Twinners and co founder of Orion Sky Studios. Thanks for coming on today.
Ash Gomez (B):
Thanks. Thanks for having me.
Jonathan Mahrt (A):
So I always like to start out just kind of as a baseline. You obviously own, own slash, co, own two companies now. But tell us, tell me a little bit about your career path and how you got to where you are today.
Ash Gomez (B):
Yeah, I mean, if you would have told me, you know, six, seven years ago I'd been running a full fledged media company, I would have been like, yeah, sure, okay. But I grew up in sales right out of high school. I was fortunate to get a sales commissions job. And I feel like that was the best breeding ground and training ground for life and for, for business. So I did that for about eight years. And in 2019, my dad had passed away and it just really shook up my world. And so I started to reflect on my life and like, what my today to my day to day was because I just didn't want to meet the same fate that he did at such a young age. And so sorry to calculate how much I sold for that company in those eight years. And when I got to that a hundred million dollar mark, I was like, whoa, that's hella cool. But to only get a fraction of that just. Just hurt. And so I really just started to look into other things, see what I can do. And then fast forward. A few months later, the pandemic hit and the company I was working for allowed us to stay home and get paid full time. So I took full advantage of that. And my brother was maybe like 12 or 13 at the time. He's living in SoCal. I'm up here and we're playing the Nintendo Switch. I was like our way to Kinect and man, we were playing for like an embarrassing like three or four hours.
Jonathan Mahrt (A):
Well, that's everyone during COVID was playing a lot of video games and those kinds of things. A lot of screen time.
Ash Gomez (B):
True that, true that. But I was having so much fun that I was looking down at my hands on the controller and I was like, man, why can't I do something that like, brings me this much joy or at least just lets me get lost in it? And I was like, wait a minute, I can fly Drones. So I started looking into different drone companies or in different Facebook groups. And I got connected with this guy on Emeryville who was just starting up his drone company. And so I helped him get clients in exchange, taught me how to fly. And he was doing a lot of like real estate media stuff. We're doing that for a good few months and getting some really good traction. But he's originally from India and I guess had submitted a government proposal program to them to start up their first drone program. And so they called them. They're like, hey, like, you know, he's like, I gotta go, like I gotta go up and do this. And I was like, dang. Like that was a week for my 27th birthday and I thought this was my, you know, my way out. But I was like, you know what? Like I know how to sell to clients and I know how to do the service. Like, let me just take a risk, invest in myself. And so bought all the equipment and two months later I quit my full time job and I basically been doing this full time ever since. And about three years into digital twinners, we started to grow a team and have a cinematographer and extra photographer on the team. And but my cinematographer, he's been flown all over the nation to do amazing videos for people and I just felt like I was limiting him to just, you know, real estate. And we had some of our realtors asking us to do some like content for the social media. So started dabbling in that and they started to get really good results. I was like, wait a minute, we have something here so we should start exploring more of the video production side at the same time of growing digital twinners. And but we quickly found that the messaging and branding was getting super confusing. It was like, wait, you can take pictures of my home and you can film my buddy's wedding. Like, oh, that's a little too, like too broad of a scope. So about two years ago now, we decided to separate the video production side from the real estate media. So we have digital twinners, it's just all real estate media. And then Orion Sky Studios, it's all of our video production. Basically any video that you see on social media that you're scrolling through.
Jonathan Mahrt (A):
Okay, cool. So let's first off, let's talk about names because you have two very interesting names for your businesses. So talk about how you got came up with digital twinners.
Ash Gomez (B):
So digital twinner. So it was actually called the virtual matter when I first opened up and about a year into opening up the business, I get a phone call from this guy. And he was like, hey, are you Ashley from the Virtual Matter? And I was like, yeah. He's like, well, I'm so and so from Virtual Matter and you're taking my business name. And I was like, oh my gosh, I am so sorry. But I hung up on the guy like immediately because I was like, so nervous. And afterwards I was like, why did I just do that? Intercom the guy back and getting it all figured out. So I had to switch names. And I have a buddy who had sold his company name to Google for over a million dollars. And he's like, if I were to start over and do this business again, I would call it Digital Twinners. And I was like, say less. You sold your company name for a million dollars? Like, I'm not. I just chose somebody else's name. I thought. I did my research. So that's where Digital Twinners came to be and for Orion Sky Studios, because I was co founding it with my two co founders, Matthew and Christian. I really wanted to have a name that we all really loved. And so we're very into like the movies and like the moon and space and all that stuff. And we always geek around with all that. That Orion just really, really worked for us, especially because it's three stars from the Ryan Belt. There's three founders. And so Orion's known to guide people through, through their journey and through their challenges. And we feel like we do that for our clients through their content and things like that.
Jonathan Mahrt (A):
That's cool. Yeah, I love, I love the thought behind the name. The. The three stars in the Belt's also a cool touched. Was that, was that like a lucky happenstance or is that part of the thought process?
Ash Gomez (B):
If I'm going to be honest, we. We decided on the name and then somebody else was like, oh, the three founders or the three stars were like, yeah, yeah, absolutely. That's exactly why we did it.
Jonathan Mahrt (A):
I bet. I'd rather be lucky than good any day.
Ash Gomez (B):
I am with you on that.
Jonathan Mahrt (A):
That's. That's awesome. Okay, so you have two businesses right now. One is focused on real estate media. So you're taking pictures of houses basically, right? Yeah.
Ash Gomez (B):
Doing all the photos, videos that you see like on Zillow and apartments.com, homes.com and things like that.
Jonathan Mahrt (A):
Okay. And then Orion, Orion sky is more digital media for. For. For B businesses. So it's B2B. You're coming up with all the video and video content for people's websites, social media, that kind of stuff.
Ash Gomez (B):
Exactly.
Jonathan Mahrt (A):
Okay, cool. So I'M to, to start with, I'm curious, like, what do you feel has been the key to growing your business? Because you've started from, you know, you bootstrap, I assume it's bootstrapped and from, from scratch. And you didn't have, it's not like you'd gone and gotten a business degree or done it with someone else. You kind of just jumped into it and started doing it. So, you know, tell, give us, give us some, give us some insights here into what's worked and what hasn't. I'm curious, yeah.
Ash Gomez (B):
Honestly, that those eight years of sales was everything because I had to be able to connect with somebody in a five to 30 minute transaction, get them to buy a bunch of things. And so you quickly have to learn how to read different personalities, meet people where they're at and how to talk to people, how to be kind. And I would say the customer experience is probably the number one reason why we, I've been able to be so, so successful. A lot of my clients, especially on digital Twitter side, like they worked with photographers who like, if you don't close down the toilet seat, like they'll just leave it open because they're not, they're just going there to take pictures. And I'm like, come on guys, like, you can close down a toilet seat, you can help them move a furniture around, like do these extra little things. And I would say probably the customer experience part because we just, if we mess up, like we're doing everything in our power to make sure that we make it right and then, and then some like helping them out on the next project or something like that. And then I would say my team, my team is absolutely spectacular. They're literally, I call them unicorns because it's hard to find somebody who's like super kind, who's competent, passionate, who's smart, who's hard working, has a drive, determination, work ethic. And my team has every single one of those traits. And so when the, our clients are interacting with myself or my team, they're getting the same type of experience the whole time. So I'd really say like that experience part is, is number one, especially in today's age with like ani, with AI and just a lot of people fronting and putting these like masks on that people really want that authenticity. And, and so one thing I failed to mention was my, my dad was a realtor. And so when I was, I was, you know, working with different companies and realtors, I found myself really gravitating more and more towards realtors, because I found that they're very similar in personality. And that's been like our mission. It was like we take everyone we work with. We take under that same umbrella that I wish I could have done for my dad, which was to help him get more clients, help him sell more listings and overall enhance his brand online. Because I truly feel that if he was able to tap into the power of social media, he would be here a lot longer because he'd be more successful and other things. But because of that heart and that care and we just truly want to do a good job, I think that's what really separates us from a lot of other people.
Jonathan Mahrt (A):
Yeah. I think, you know, it's amazing how big of a difference just caring makes.
Ash Gomez (B):
Yeah.
Jonathan Mahrt (A):
Because people are. It's. It's. And you're competing against other, you know, solopreneurs and small businesses. Right. It's not like you're competing probably against very many huge corporations when it comes to taking pictures. Pictures of houses and stuff.
Ash Gomez (B):
Not yet. Not yet, but yes.
Jonathan Mahrt (A):
I'm not trying to limit you. I'm not putting a ceiling on you. Okay. I'm just saying you think typically what you expect is when you're working with small businesses, that is one of the reasons you do it, is because they care more. That's at least the baseline expectation most people have. But I'm surprised by how many people don't get that.
Ash Gomez (B):
Oh, my gosh, Honestly, I'm grateful for those people because those people have. Making me tons and tons of money. So I'm like, go ahead, keep doing your thing, because it's making us stand out way, way more because of that. But you're right. I don't know why that there is that type of disconnect, but I'm grateful for it because it has allowed me to be successful with it.
Jonathan Mahrt (A):
So you think you've, you know, speaking on the digital twin side of things, you think that's the. I mean, because you're selling a commodity. Right. I mean, I know lots of people are like, yeah, I'm trying to do real estate photography. Well, I mean, I've heard it anecdotally. So is the primary differentiator, like, yeah, most. Like most people probably can take a decent picture. It's just about the customer service aspect of it.
Ash Gomez (B):
Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. I would say. And I've had agents tell me, like, I know they take better, better photos than you do, but I know that you're going to be reliable. I know that I can leave you with My client, my seller, and know that they're going to have a good experience. I know I'm going to get the photos on time. I know that you're going to help me move some of the furniture around. We'll remove some of the things from the photo. Complimentary. Just because sometimes there's messy tenants, you know, and there's like nothing our agent can do. But why should they have to suffer for those type of imagery when we have the tools to be able to, you know, clean that stuff?
Jonathan Mahrt (A):
Right, right.
Ash Gomez (B):
Instead of charging, you know, these outrageous prices and things like that. But yeah, I would probably say that that is probably it. Especially with our, like once you become a digital twinners client, like 90% of them stay. I have a very, very, very low churn rate and most of my clients have been with me since year one, so that's pretty. I'm very proud of that, but very grateful because my team's been able to be that extension of me because I would not be able to do it without them.
Jonathan Mahrt (A):
Yeah, no, absolutely, absolutely. I think it's crazy that so many small businesses are often selling a commodity like that. In the grand scheme of things, it's just about execution, you know. And like you literally heard I actually, your pictures are maybe a little bit worse, but not meaningfully. I'm sure if they were awful, then that would be different. Right? They're a little bit worse, but the rest of the experience is so much better. And just like in the net, you make my life easier because I'm having to manage my client less. I'm having to, I'm having to, I'm getting, having to, you know, do less work to make sure I get an acceptable product. It's just like that means if I'm a realtor, that means I say, hey, go take pictures. I know you've got it handled. Not going to have to track you down because you said you were going to give them to me on Tuesday and it's Friday. You know, all those things makes, you know, just, just that execution makes such a big difference when it comes to small business.
Ash Gomez (B):
Oh, big time. Especially when you're working with realtors. I always joke around as saying like, you're trying to reign in a wild bull when you're working with them. They want everything done yesterday. And so we really optimize our business to like, once we take photos, like next day they're in their inbox. The video does take a little bit longer, but when it comes to like the photos and small stuff, they get it Very quickly.
Jonathan Mahrt (A):
Well, so I think that comes to. One of the things I'm always curious about is in order to execute at a high level, you have to have good processes. It's one of the things I try and help businesses with. Right. Whether both a combination, it's a combination of whatever your digital tools are, but also just having basic workflows and processes defined and actually using them. So how, what, what is what. What do you, what tool. I'm curious what tools you're using and kind of what your, your workflow is when it comes to delivering a product to your customer.
Ash Gomez (B):
Yeah. Which I bet you're saying this. There's so many different, like type of tools you can use and things like that, but I really think it's like what's working for you. One of the biggest tools we use is ClickUp. ClickUp basically houses all of our CRM, all of our marketing, all of our, our client flow. And I would say that is what's been like the bedrock for our business of being able to like, you can look in there and everyone knows exactly what they're supposed to be doing, who's doing what, how they're doing it and all of that. And then we use a lot of automation with like emails and things like that. So when like one client, you know, comes in, like a property checklist, gets sent out to them immediately saying, hey, you know, thank you so much for booking with us. You know, here's the document that you can share with your seller to get the property ready. This is the photographer that's going to be there. Here's the phone number. If you have any questions. Then we do the shoot and once we deliver the product, 24 hours later they get an email saying, hey, you can know, you can download this. But then 24 hours later they do get another email saying, hey, like, how do we do? How was our feet? Like getting some feedback there, like how to go for a photographer. How is it with our photos? Is there anything that we can do there? And so we have that kind of just like a little automated process. And honestly my admin, Tom, is probably, probably the one who's getting that all in order and all together. I'm better with the front facing and talking to the clients. Yeah. So my team handles all that. So I can take you as far as far as there when it comes to like how it all breaks down. But yeah, huge shout out to my team. Thank you, Vanessa and Tom.
Jonathan Mahrt (A):
That's, I mean, that's perfect. That's, I mean, if you don't if you want to grow your business, you have to eventually start working with people and then you have to be able to trust them to, to, to do the things and you want to find people that are good at the things you're not good at. You know, optimize for the things that only you can do. That's an important part of learning how to run a business.
Ash Gomez (B):
Double down on your strengths and outsource your weaknesses. That is one of my mottos.
Jonathan Mahrt (A):
Absolutely. Absolutely. Absol. Absolutely. I mean I started working with a virtual assistant because I just knew that like there was a bunch of. There was a bunch of piddly things that I always just would put off and never get to. And so I'm just paying someone to hold me accountable and make sure that those things get done.
Ash Gomez (B):
I wonder for you though, with you being so in depth with systems, like how are you not revamping your system every other day when you come across a new platform or a new tool?
Jonathan Mahrt (A):
Because I've. That's a great question because actually I remember, I think you've been using ClickUp for a long time and so I'm actually impressed that you're still using it. I. Trying something new. We were talking with the podcast producer before we started about he's vibe coding stuff. There's a real danger to like be busy always trying a new system to try and like you think you're going to squeeze another like couple percent of efficiency out of something. Um, and then you just end up wasting a bunch of time always like building something and trying new things instead of getting actual work done. Because feeling people often mix up being busy with being productive.
Ash Gomez (B):
Yeah.
Jonathan Mahrt (A):
And you're. And you're only being productive when you're actually getting the important work done. If. And my experience in the past has been that I'm always trying new things, but I found myself running up against that wall where like I'm always trying new stuff but I'm never really getting anything more from it. And so if I'm going to switch to something, then I really, it has to really have a meaningful positive impact on my business. And the other issue I found is that when you're solo there's more flexibility to change things. But when you start building a team or including other people, what works for you doesn't necessarily work for everyone else. And I have, I optimize actually more for simplicity then, then for big complicated because like using tool like notion a ClickUp could be one like that where it's just like an endless rabbit hole of you just optimizing things forever, you know. And so like my project management tool is a tool called Basecamp which, And one the reason like Basecamp is actually light. It does a lot, but it's light on complexity because even I have a lot of clients that are really not very technical, but they can sign up and start using it instantly basically because it's so simple. And that to me is more like what I miss out on. A little bit of like automation and kind of nerdery and optimizing. I make up for that. It's easy for me to onboard people that I work with on it onto it and onboard clients onto it and they actually use it. Right. You could have the greatest tool in the world, but if no one uses it, then it's kind of useless. Then it's not kind of. It is useless.
Ash Gomez (B):
Yeah. And that's a special part for what you're doing is because you know, people are coming to you because they, they don't have, you know, the, the techie experience and things like that. So the last thing you want to do is send them down to click up, you know, rabbit hole. There's so many nuances to it. So you have to find that happy medium for yourself with still getting what you need, but make sure your clients are able to use it as well.
Jonathan Mahrt (A):
Exactly. And most of my clients too are people that are like even more not tech savvy. So you just have to there because the worst position for me to be in from a customer service perspective and this is a problem that a lot of clients fall into and why they often need my help is like they won't go and try. They get sold that this tool is going to make their life so much better. But a. It's like they get oversold something or they get sold something and then they get no help actually implementing it or they, they get overwhelmed by it because it's too much to do. So there's like this real fine balance between a tool that's going to do enough and. But also be something they'll actually use. Because I don't want to end up in a situation convincing someone to use something and then they have a terrible experience with it and don't actually use it.
Ash Gomez (B):
Yeah.
Jonathan Mahrt (A):
And so I, it's. I had that. I had that issue once where a client, I. It was a. The tool was fine, but the, the implementation by the software company was atrocious and so I had to step in and like kind of like jump back into the project and take it over more and reinsert myself and then work, do a bunch of free work to make up for the fact that they did such a terrible job because it was reflecting me. So.
Ash Gomez (B):
Yeah, well, thankfully sometimes those lessons you only have to learn once.
Jonathan Mahrt (A):
That's correct. That is correct. I learned from that. I said, okay, I'm. If you're working with me, I'm staying on through the whole process and after it's implemented to make sure that you actually get what you want from it. And that's just it. If you can't, don't feel like you want to pay for that or it's not, then okay, then it may not be the right fit. But that's the only way I'm going to make sure that you have a good experience and you're actually getting the value from going through all this headache.
Ash Gomez (B):
Yeah. Smart.
Jonathan Mahrt (A):
Yeah. So the. What I. The next thing. Oh, I wanted to ask about the, the review process. Are you keeping all that in ClickUp, just the reviews, or do you have a separate tool you're using to capture reviews? Or is it just like an email saying, yeah, things were great, or like, I'm curious how you're capturing the feedback?
Ash Gomez (B):
Most times, surprisingly, they actually don't reply to the email. But they all see it. They all see it, they all acknowledge it. They love that they get it. And so.
Jonathan Mahrt (A):
Oh no, I believe that people don't click on that. I never do.
Ash Gomez (B):
So when they do, it's typically like we'll take screenshots of it and we'll use it within our video marketing and things like that or put it on our website. But we do put the Google link in there and hopes that they, you know, put it on Google as well.
Jonathan Mahrt (A):
Yeah, that's, that's, that's cool. So what do you know what your response rate is? Because I am curious.
Ash Gomez (B):
Response rate on like actually clicking to review.
Jonathan Mahrt (A):
It's okay if you don't know.
Ash Gomez (B):
I don't know.
Jonathan Mahrt (A):
Yeah, not necessarily. I'm just curious. One thing that you could consider for the future is that there are tool like review management tools where they'll just ask you to give like a thumbs up or a thumbs down about the service. If you give a thumbs up, then it points you to the Google review. Right. And then if you get a thumbs down, it says, oh, how? Then it just says, hey, tell us how we could do better and doesn't direct them to leave an actual review.
Ash Gomez (B):
Okay. Okay, good.
Jonathan Mahrt (A):
Something to think about. Something to think about. It sounds like you probably have mostly good reviews, so it's Maybe not such a big deal, but can be a useful tool to like still capture negative feedback, which can be helpful but not have it negatively impact your business.
Ash Gomez (B):
Yeah.
Jonathan Mahrt (A):
You know, so you can still learn from it. But um, you know, it doesn't, you know, because negative, negative reviews can be tricky.
Ash Gomez (B):
They can, especially when they're, they're live like that. Thankfully we don't really, you know, have that knock on.
Jonathan Mahrt (A):
Yeah, I don't want to be, I.
Ash Gomez (B):
Don'T want to be responsible but, but that's, I would say one of the. When you had asked me the question or like what separates us is like we're constantly asking for feedback. How can we be better? You know, what can we offer you that'll you know, enhanced your, your experience working with us and your work? And an example of this is Matterport 3D which creates 3D virtual tours and Zillow are currently at war with each other and a lot of customers get the Matterport 3D Tour. This was what was like really born in. I mean it's been around for years, but people started using it heavily when the pandemic started because they weren't able to do open houses and. But so a lot of clients still get that. And because of the war that Zillow and Matterport is having, Zillow is not allowing for Matterport tours to be on Zillow anymore. And instead of us just being like, well, we spent, you know, a thousand dollars on this camera, we're still just going to use this like, no, we invested into the Zillow camera. So we can still offer that to our clients, still make sure that they can, you know, win on both sides. But it's just stuff like that where we, we take in that feedback from them and you know, do our best to, to make it work. Obviously we can't like move mountains and stuff like that, but if it's within reason, we'll do our best to, you know, make those adjustments.
Jonathan Mahrt (A):
Yeah, absolutely. I mean, speaking of talk about negative customer feedback for a second, the tough thing about, to me about negative customer feedback is, you know, most reviews are either really good or really bad. There's not a lot of in between reviews and then the negative reviews. If you are generally a company that does a good job, are often don't tell the whole story, don't give a full picture of the situation or maybe very skewed interpretation of things. So when you have had bad review, how, how do you handle it?
Ash Gomez (B):
It? Well, thankfully we haven't had any bad review. That's you know, out there. But how do I handle it? I really just, I would say this is what a little caveat is, I would say from not coming from a photography world. Like, I never grew up, you know, taking pictures and aspired to do that. And so there's a. And the people who do, they have this level of artistry inside of there. They're a creator. They're like, this is their artwork.
Jonathan Mahrt (A):
It's more personal.
Ash Gomez (B):
Yeah, way more personal. And so with me, I look at it from a business standpoint. So when I did get one feedback, I was like, okay, so you didn't like this? You don't like that. Cool. Tell my cinematographer, hey, let's go reshoot this area. Photographer. Hey, let's reshoot this area. And it's just, to me, it's like a no brainer, like, okay, cool, you didn't like it. We can go and change it up. That's not a big deal. But before I was being that buffer for my team and the feedback would go directly to my team. That's when the feathers should be ruffled. They're like, what? I did this on purpose because of this, this and that. And like, I get it. We can keep it for our internal marketing. I think it looks great, but at the end of the day, this is what the client wants. Even if we don't think it's the right thing, like, we can educate the client, but if that's what they still want, like, we're going to give it to them. Yeah, that's what they want. So I think I, I don't take it personal. I just see it as a business, you know, you don't like something cool, what do you like? How can we make that happen?
Jonathan Mahrt (A):
That is the tough part about creative stuff, is that it is, you know, it's, it's naturally an extension of you. And so it's hard to separate the, the, like, this is just a difference of opinion versus like taking it personally.
Ash Gomez (B):
Oh, yeah, yeah. I had a. I would say my team's grown in that way, but still, you know, But I get it, I get it because they put their heart and soul, they think and breathe photography and videography and movies and researching and all of that. And so they're very methodical and why they shoot and how they do it. So when, you know, somebody doesn't quite understand they wanted a certain way, like, I get it. Um, but at the day we're business, you know, they hire us for a service and we got to do provide that service.
Jonathan Mahrt (A):
Right. So let's talk about Orion Sky a little bit. So you're. How, how is. So that's a little bit different because you're. It's not kind of the same process necessarily over and over again. Right? What, what kind of stuff are you shooting for Orion Sky?
Ash Gomez (B):
Oh, man. All, all over the place, I would say. People who are trying to make a difference in the world. Like we shot for this one guy who was developing an app. He's an older gentleman and put his whole entire life savings into this app to help revolutionize the, revolutionize the middle class. He wanted the middle class to understand, you know, the financial decisions you make today, like how that impacts you in five, 20, you know, 30 years. And so he put his whole life saving, his savings into this thing. And so we made him like an introductory video that's on YouTube to get people to sign up and, and then just different, like influencers. I work one of the top influencers here in Sonoma County, Danny Maturinga, he's a fitness guy. We worked with Callum Von Moger, who's another fitness guy down in la. He played Arnold Schwarzenegger in the Arnold documentary. But basically anything you see on YouTube, like YouTube, Instagram, TikTok and Facebook and putting those videos on their website or email campaigns, basically videos that are going to help a brand, you know, share their message, whether that's to get brand awareness, more sales leads, just get them more exposure.
Jonathan Mahrt (A):
Yeah, okay, very cool. So I'm one thing I want to ask is because I'm curious about this because this is something I'm actively working on is what do you do for lead generation in with both of your businesses? Whether it's different or the same thing, I'm curious what the source is and what you're doing.
Ash Gomez (B):
So on digital Twitter side, we run Google Ads, which bring in, you know, tons of business from phone calls, text messages, people inquiring about things. Then we do a direct message outreach through our social media. On Instagram, we're just a cool DMs to agents and that's another way that we bring it in. Then we have a referral program as well for our agents. So if they refer anybody over to us, they do get a special discount on their next shoot. And then our Ryan sky studio side, we're in a lot of different networking groups like bni. We do Google Ads as well. And we just launched a partnership program for like web developers, web designers, actually people like yourself, just basically people who are working with businesses that we can work with and grow their brand. But what we found with like web designers and digital marketing companies is their biggest, their biggest problem is getting quality content from their clients. And they're not videographers, not photographers. You know, they're there to market and do everything online to get them more business. But the quality of media that they get from their clients is pretty low. So we offer a special partnership program for those companies to, you know, introduce us to their clients, we make them great content and then in turn they get to use that content on their marketing campaigns and they're making even more money for their clients. So it is like the biggest win, win, win situation that we could be a part of.
Jonathan Mahrt (A):
Yeah, that is, that is interesting because I having worked with some like digital marketing companies lots of times they're great at like executing ads, knowing how to schedule things, you know, all the targeting, you know, they're great at the strategy part of it and the execution of it. The content part of it is more, more difficult or they're like, oh, we got to work with you. Like some of them will have an in house person that knows what they're doing. But lots of times you're just expecting like, I got to still come up with reels and record myself and send them to you. Well, like that's kind of for the client. That's like the hardest part.
Ash Gomez (B):
Exactly, exactly. And so with this partnership program, we offer their clients a 45 minute, 30 day content engine workshop. We basically teach them all about different types of content they can make, what the posting cadence looks like, where they should be targeting their clients, whether on like Instagram or LinkedIn. Because the way that you position yourself on each of those platforms, massively different across the platforms, you and basically just give them all the tools, teach them absolutely everything, they can go fish for themselves. But if they find that, hey, they don't have enough time, da da, da, then they can go ahead and hire us to execute it for them.
Jonathan Mahrt (A):
Yeah, I think that's a great way to give them some value and then get warm leads from it.
Ash Gomez (B):
Oh definitely. I have such an abundance mindset that I don't mind like sharing all the industry secrets that we have and what's worked for our clients because I genuinely want to see people win. And when people are winning online like at a certain point, eventually they're going to think of us because we help them in that, you know, a little piece of that. Or they're making so much money online they're like, hey, now finally I can pay someone else to do it.
Jonathan Mahrt (A):
Yeah.
Ash Gomez (B):
And so I think it's a great business plan. Makes me feel good, makes me feel like I'm actually, you know, helping people, not just taking their money. I'm literally giving us tons of value to help them win.
Jonathan Mahrt (A):
Yeah, that's an important conversation I have sometimes. You know, my, actually I have this conversation with my wife sometimes. She's like, why are you, why are you giving them so much advice for free? I'm like, well, because like I'm trying to establish my reputation. I'm trying to, I'm trying to give them value so they can understand the value I can provide to them. And like I'm not going to nickel and dime someone for like a 15 minute phone call about something, you know, like it doesn't like I'm not going to try and paywall everything because hopefully like, oh wow, Jonathan was so helpful. He provided so much value to me. So maybe I have an opportunity for a bigger project. I'm going to call Jonathan or I know someone comes up to me and says, oh I have this problem, Jonathan will be great for your solution.
Ash Gomez (B):
A hundred percent. And I, I love that that's the way I do business. That's the way that I, I like to be done business with. Like, I, I think it just feels so much more fulfilling. I feel like it's more sustainable and especially in this day and 8 with AI and these low hanging fruit that we were talking about earlier with people who just don't have, they just don't care. Like that type of mixture of, you know, caring and giving as much value and not gatekeeping, like it's, it's very rare these days and so they're making it super easy for us to win. It's just a matter of getting in front of those people.
Jonathan Mahrt (A):
Yes, absolutely, absolutely. So you mentioned AI. I think that's one of the big topics I wanted to talk about today because AI is, you know, one of the biggest threats or people that feel the most threatened are creatives because it's so easy to just to like type a prompt in and get something. And the video stuff, the photography stuff is getting better and better. I don't know if you saw the Google the Nana Banana Pro thing, crazy. I was playing with it, I was like, I mean it's legitimately nuts from where you used to have like, you know, think people used to have like five fingers and an extra eye and it couldn't spell and all this kind of crazy stuff. In the last two or three years it's come crazy far. So talk to me a Little bit about how you're feeling about AI, how you feel like it's affecting your, your industry.
Ash Gomez (B):
Yeah, that's a, it's a tough one. I, I guess my motto is use AI before AI uses. Uses you. And with the, I mean we explore, we do use it in some of our, our work, like with our digital twin side, like vacant listings on our videos. Like we can, you know, now add furniture into it and make it look pretty cool. But we're just dabbling in it. I am just taking it day by day. I'm not trying to, you know, doom and gloom because if I do, then I will not get out of bed. Or like, I'm just not like, why am I doing this today then if it's going to be like that? And so I just try to live in these daytime compartments. Let me make the most that I can do today. But I think too is the customer experience part. Like that AI will never ever, ever be able to replicate like this human connection. Like truly caring, like AI can artificially do that, but like, does it have that genuine connection there? And, and I think we're a little blessed too, living in a place like Sonoma county where people do value the face to face.
Jonathan Mahrt (A):
It's a fair point.
Ash Gomez (B):
Yeah, yeah. And so I feel like it might take a little bit longer here before the way that it's going to impact the rest of the world. But honestly I have no clue, I have no clue the way that it's going to be. But I think that the a time I'll be worried is when it's man against machine. You know, right now it's still man using machine the way that it's always been for hundreds of years. So it's like until that changes then I, I think I feel a type of way, but I'm just trying to make the most out of today and hopefully it'll take care of itself tomorrow while still being mindful of the AI information that's out there, still utilizing the tool, see how we can bring it into our business. But I don't. Yeah, I don't know if it's going to replace us maybe.
Jonathan Mahrt (A):
Well, yeah, I don't expect you to have the answer to that because really there's lots of real people, smarter people, much smarter than both of us and they don't have the answer to that. Yeah, I mean, I don't want to go down a huge AI rabbit hole, but, but what I think is really, I think what you touched on, that AI can't replicate and what people What I feel like people are valuing more and more, at least I find that myself is authenticity because that's, that's what you feel. That's everyone's visceral reaction to a lot of, to AI generated content. Right. Not necessarily AI giving you like a summary of something you've done or AI helping you like pull all the information off of an invoice and automatically fill something out for you. But the, the generative AI is what people I think have a negative reaction to and they, it can't replace face to face interaction and authenticity. And I think the human touch is what people are going to come to value more to more and more as AI gets better and better.
Ash Gomez (B):
Oh yeah, oh yeah. I think that's why there's a rise in, in podcasts, there's a rise in more reality style TV rather than just some other stuff that's out there. Because people are craving that human connection, that human touch. And even if people aren't realizing that that's what they're craving, like that's what they gravitate towards. And the people who are utilizing the technology, utilizing AI, like I don't think there's anything wrong with that. I just think it's just being mindful of like what that can lead to in the future.
Jonathan Mahrt (A):
Yeah, no, I think it is important to be mindful of how it's deployed. And I would say like most people are using like from a creative perspective, are using AI to help them create stuff that in a situation where either they were going to go and make something really ugly and word before, between AI and Canva, they were going to make something really ugly and word before because they couldn't afford to pay anyone. So actually AI is a great equalizer in that it allows you get to get business off the ground, have professional looking materials for things and have your crap together. And then I think most people, once they can afford it, want to pay a professional to do stuff and be creative and come up with things once they get, get a little bit more scale.
Ash Gomez (B):
Yeah, I mean, that's right.
Jonathan Mahrt (A):
Yeah, that's true, that's true. I mean you never know where all that stuff's going to, going to go. But I know that's certainly how I feel right when I'm, you know, there's certain things like I would love to pay a designer to come up with artwork for this particular thing, but I can't afford to pay them that. So I'm going to go use AI to generate something and hope it looks good enough. I think I think the other thing is, like you said, that staying aware of what is going on with changes in AI and being willing to use it still because it's going to happen. People are, people are using it. I mean, like, you know, my grandparents know what chat GBT is and talk to it. So it's here, It's. Yeah, it's. It's going to be to stay. It's going to be here to stay. So if you aren't trying to find ways to leverage it in your business, then you're going to get left behind.
Ash Gomez (B):
Oh yeah. I mean, your competitors using it right now, like right this second. So it's like, use it, but use it to your advantage. How can it help you as opposed to, you know, take you out, so to speak. Because pretty soon like an agent is going to be able to walk through a property and just take their own pictures and put it through some AI platform and bam, there's all the photos. But I, I truly value, just like our experience that we do have with them, that they don't have to walk into a house to do that themselves. They are still wanting to hire someone like ourselves. And so it's like, how do we differentiate ourselves? And that's through that customer experience and making sure that we're an extension of them when we're, you know, in front of their clients and having good, good interaction with them as well.
Jonathan Mahrt (A):
Yeah, no, absolutely. So, I mean, that's the biggest take, takeaway I think is just stay nimble.
Ash Gomez (B):
Yeah. Stay human.
Jonathan Mahrt (A):
Yeah, yeah. When, when it comes to, when it comes to AI. So we are getting close to the end of our time. It's been an awesome conversation. There's a couple questions I, I like to ask everyone. The first is, is there a book that you either gift or recommend a lot to people?
Ash Gomez (B):
There's two books. There is a Go Giver that I think really revolutionized the way that I think about business, think about sales because when I was in those eight years of sales, I was taught that traditional sale sharky type of way. And yes, it works when, in certain situations, but when you're in a business and you're talking to other business owners, like that doesn't work. And I couldn't understand why at first until learning more about, you know, different sales techniques. And that Go Giver book really just shifted everything in the way that I do business and how I approach, you know, every, every, honestly, every conversation where it's basically give more value than what you receive in return and having that faith that it's going to come back to you. And then the next One is Alex Ramosi's 100 million dollar money models book. I mean I think all his hundred million dollar offer books are absolutely awesome, but that million, that Money models book is really great for any type of service business. Any type of business honestly, that is looking to get more money and position themselves in a just think about how to sell their services in a very unique way that maybe we don't see on a day to day basis to really help separate yourself from your competitors.
Jonathan Mahrt (A):
Those are two great recommendations. I, I think that especially the, the go giver. I think when we've met a couple years ago, that was I you mentioned that book then that's a core part of being in BNI is is givers gain. It's just another way of saying that and just providing value to people. It's what we talked about earlier in the podcast and that's definitely been my mindset as well. Is just trying to give more value than receiving because it, it, it does, it does come back to you. People remember that stuff. If you're always just if you have a scarcity mindset, a it's just like a stressful way to live. Seriously, I think that's like selfishly like just always being worried that you know you're gonna miss out on an opportunity is just like it, it's just like it's too much.
Ash Gomez (B):
Yeah.
Jonathan Mahrt (A):
But then, but then second it's just people pick up on that energy too. When you're putting it out there and you're just like wait. You end up being way too aggressive, way too pushy. You don't feel authentic. It just messes with all of your motivations.
Ash Gomez (B):
Yeah. Big time.
Jonathan Mahrt (A):
So the other, the other question I like to ask people is if you could put one thing like up on a billboard up over the freeway, one piece of wisdom to impart to people, what would it, what would it be?
Ash Gomez (B):
Great question. There's two things that come to mind. The first one is choose your hard because running a business is hard. Working out of five is hard. It's just what hard do you want to do you want to deal with? I think too many people go into things because they want that certain outcome but don't realize the list of problems that come along with it. And I think when you go into something knowing what the outcome is going to be, knowing the hardships that is going to come with it and you're choosing for those hardships, it's going to make the whole process just way more Easier and just enjoyable because it's not about the destination, it is about the journey. The other thing that comes to mind, and this is from one of my mentors, Leila Hermosi, is fuck your mood and follow the plan. Too many times have I let, like, my own mood or my own feelings, you know, get in the way. And I think that that has been absolutely a staple for me and like, super transformational for me when I realized that just because I'm feeling this way doesn't mean I need to act on this, that I can still stick, I can still follow the plan.
Jonathan Mahrt (A):
Yeah, I think I really, I mean, I resonate with both of them, but especially the second one, because that was one thing that I didn't. The, the feelings are what I didn't expect as much in running your own business. It's just like you, you just like, sometimes things are really frustrating, you know, it's like easy to get down. You're like, I have this plan. And the tension I always feel and that I've struggled with a lot of the second half of this year is like sticking with a plan versus how I'm feeling and knowing, like, when I need to pivot and change and like, do a new strategy. But also like, it's so easy, especially just in kind of our, you know, TikTok kind of like fast paced instant gratification culture that like, oh, this isn't working. Try something new. This isn't working. Try something new. But you also got to like, give things enough time to cook. At least if it's a reasonable idea. Right. If it's terrible, then that's different. But assuming your idea is like reasonable, you know, if you haven't given it enough time, then you can't just bounce to the next thing because you're just going to be stuck in the cycle of just always trying things but never getting anywhere. Being busy but not productive.
Ash Gomez (B):
Exactly, exactly. You just get into that hole of like, you know, it's easy at first because, you know, it's a fun part at first. And then it gets to the weeds and then that's where people must jump off and then go to the next thing and it's like, well, you never build something sustainable if you're not willing to stick it out in the weeds. And it's a constant reminder for myself. But yeah, I would like, I live by those words.
Jonathan Mahrt (A):
I think those were like two really great. Two billboards.
Ash Gomez (B):
Two great billboards.
Jonathan Mahrt (A):
So that is it. That is the end of our time. I want to give you an opportunity to shout out, where can people find you? What do you want people. Where do people. Where do you want people to check you out online?
Ash Gomez (B):
Yeah, you can follow me on Instagram @ashleym.gomez underscore. You can. You'll be able to see my other big companies on there as well. But yeah, cool.
Jonathan Mahrt (A):
Yeah, your links to all your stuff will also be in the podcast slash YouTube description. And I just want to thank you for being on again. It was awesome. It was a great conversation and I'm looking forward to maybe next time.
Ash Gomez (B):
Hey, I'll talk to you again another two years.
Jonathan Mahrt (A):
Okay, Sounds good. Thank you.
Ash Gomez (B):
Thank you, Sam.